I am listening to Ball of Thread podcast which is thorough but not concise and I feel marginally more informed than before. But it’s clear Russia is playing us on multiple levels.
(I am not oblivious to the fact that I may be the victim of disinformation about disinformation. But those sources, and some of their sources, seemed trustworthy to me.)
Based on our experiences here in the US, I believe the situation requires some nuance.
Russia is definitely doing everything they can to make things worse. But the liberal democracies have internal weaknesses that are the true cause of our problems.
So, Russia is clearly not friendly, and we shouldn't have any illusions abut that. But blaming them for our own problems isn't realistic, and it won't help us fix them.
They are doing that against all of their perceived adversaries, and probably some of their allies. So, it's not just liberal democracies, although it is very much that, too.
in Hungary we observe and examine our gov't presenting propaganda generated by the russian agencies, shared by surrounding past and current pro-russian right-wing populist governments. Most of them clearly have the one source and the same dance steps, and very obvious and not even disguised russian design. It is documented even in places like Wikipedia and scientific works. I do not see any question here.
Russia *is* trying to stoke division in Western countries and boost politicians that are friendlier. But Western societies already have deep divisions and disagreements over foreign policy, so it's unclear how consequential Russian activity has been.
of course. and so isn't every other major player in world politics. why would you hold them to a higher standard than any other "first world" country? like, were any of you genuinely surprised? not even trying to be a dick, at this point, just, like genuinely confused. is this like when people acted surprised over PRISM again?
This is interesting. I am a qualified yes. I'm usually a strong yes, but every once in a while I read something about "alleged disinformation campaigns" or whatever, and I remember that most of the evidence is shadowy and indirect. So, I'm *pretty* sure, but if in 20 years we get a behind the scenes story of uncoordinated attacks or competing factions or whatever, I wouldn't be totally surprised.
Okay, so we all see it, we've seen it for ten years, the Russians said they would do it, we know who is doing it, we observe them doing it here in the USA and in other countries. So what can we do about it? Nothing.
It's an active cyber warfare against the west's population to which apparently we have our eyes closed. However, IMO it does not seem to be just Russia. Other actors like China are involved as well.
I'm a strong yes. Most of it is just about sowing chaos and inflaming pre-existing conflicts, not some 👿 shot clever manipulations, but pretty much all big countries do this. China, the US and Russia do a lot of this kind of thing (see the recent revelations about the CIA propaganda against the Chinese COVID vaccine, something I noticed going on at the time but was unsure of the source of the FUD campaign).
nus
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Logan 🇵🇸💾🌹
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Gretchen Anderson
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Olivier Mehani
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Strong yes.
For lack of a more authoritative reference: https://www.reddit.com/r/GenZ/comments/1bfto4a/youre_being_targeted_by_disinformation_networks
Not that the US hasn't done the same https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-covid-propaganda/
With #disinformation , everybody loses.
(I am not oblivious to the fact that I may be the victim of disinformation about disinformation. But those sources, and some of their sources, seemed trustworthy to me.)
Stu
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Noah Cook
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Dave Neary
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Laure
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Alex Strasheim
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Based on our experiences here in the US, I believe the situation requires some nuance.
Russia is definitely doing everything they can to make things worse. But the liberal democracies have internal weaknesses that are the true cause of our problems.
So, Russia is clearly not friendly, and we shouldn't have any illusions abut that. But blaming them for our own problems isn't realistic, and it won't help us fix them.
Bruce Heerssen
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •grin
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •M. Grégoire
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •ergifruit
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Evan Prodromou
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •8
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Phil Landmeier
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Pepper
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •Fifi Lamoura
in reply to Evan Prodromou • • •